Title Changed to Kicking Nitrate's @ss?"

Ask equipment questions here.

Re: Title Changed to Kicking Nitrate's @ss?"

Postby Kmuda » Thu Nov 17, 2011 10:13 pm

That's a good question. I had the media in use for almost 3 years before I achieved "complete denitrification". For the previous period of time I had managed to cut nitrates in 1/2. Then I made changes (documented in this thread) and suddenly started achieving "complete denitrification" (maintaining zero nitrates). That lasted for 6 months before I went back to nitrates basically being 1/2 of what they would be if the filter was not in use.

There has been two cleanings of the media in that period of time. The first was just before I started achieving zero nitrates. After that 6 month period and I again started experiencing nitrate creep, I cleaned the media again (although not as well) but did not get it back down to zero nitrate. Next week I am on vacation and with Christmas coming up don't want to shell out the money for replacement media just yet. So I intend to break it down, performing a more complete cleaning of the media (which involves rinsing it well in a bucket of water and then boiling it for about an hour) and see what I get from there. If I don't get back to the zero nitrates, I'll replace the media sometime next year.
100g- Red Oscar Fish, Male Convict, 3 SDs - 20 gallon sump
55g - 21 Year Old Kissing Gourami + friends
55g - Angelfish - 29g Livebearer Community
4 Cats, 2 Shelties, 1 wife, 1 old lady, and one of the sub-adults broke back in.
User avatar
Kmuda
Mad Scientist
Mad Scientist
 
Posts: 16556
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2006 8:13 pm
Location: Fort Smith, Arkansas

Re: Title Changed to Kicking Nitrate's @ss?"

Postby Capt Dave » Thu Nov 17, 2011 10:19 pm

Gotcha. Have you tried any other smaller pore media other than matrix or denitrate?
User avatar
Capt Dave
Symphysodon discus
 
Posts: 299
Joined: Sat Feb 20, 2010 5:34 pm
Location: Long Island, New York

Re: Title Changed to Kicking Nitrate's @ss?"

Postby Kmuda » Thu Nov 17, 2011 10:38 pm

Not really. I think the options are limited. What's important is that the interior pores of the media is the only location that is low in Oxygen. The physical structure of SeaChem Denitrate fits the bill. Not many other medias will. The old Hagen Biomax might but it has been discontinued in lieu of Fluval Biomax, which will not work. Sera makes a ceramic ring they claim will support denitrification but I have not tried it. Refreesh H2O would probably work if you wanted to cover the expense and could find it (they went Bankrupt, I think I bought the last 8 bags of it on the planet).

But I don't think you will achieve these types of results with standard biomedia. I don't think you would even achieve these results with SeaChem Matrix, which is the same material as SeaChem Denitrate, just larger "chunks". It's an odd combination of pore size and media size that enables what I call "Safe Denitrification" and thus far, the only thing I've found that "fits" is SeaChem Denitrate.
100g- Red Oscar Fish, Male Convict, 3 SDs - 20 gallon sump
55g - 21 Year Old Kissing Gourami + friends
55g - Angelfish - 29g Livebearer Community
4 Cats, 2 Shelties, 1 wife, 1 old lady, and one of the sub-adults broke back in.
User avatar
Kmuda
Mad Scientist
Mad Scientist
 
Posts: 16556
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2006 8:13 pm
Location: Fort Smith, Arkansas

Re: Title Changed to Kicking Nitrate's @ss?"

Postby Kmuda » Mon Nov 21, 2011 4:07 pm

I've broken it down. The filter holds 5 gallons of media and about 1 gallon of water. :lol:

I'm thinking I need to increase the amount of water, which means decreasing the amount of media. I've scrubbed all of the media clean and am currently making Kmuda Soup with it. We'll see if I regain its denitrification performance after a good cleaning.
100g- Red Oscar Fish, Male Convict, 3 SDs - 20 gallon sump
55g - 21 Year Old Kissing Gourami + friends
55g - Angelfish - 29g Livebearer Community
4 Cats, 2 Shelties, 1 wife, 1 old lady, and one of the sub-adults broke back in.
User avatar
Kmuda
Mad Scientist
Mad Scientist
 
Posts: 16556
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2006 8:13 pm
Location: Fort Smith, Arkansas

Re: Title Changed to Kicking Nitrate's @ss?"

Postby Kmuda » Mon Nov 21, 2011 10:19 pm

Four hours to break it down and completely clean the filter media. Well.... 5 minutes to break it down and put it back up. 3 hours and 55 minutes to properly clean the media. :lol:

Hopefully it was not a wasted exercise but I had to go through it before shelling out a couple hundred bucks for new media.
100g- Red Oscar Fish, Male Convict, 3 SDs - 20 gallon sump
55g - 21 Year Old Kissing Gourami + friends
55g - Angelfish - 29g Livebearer Community
4 Cats, 2 Shelties, 1 wife, 1 old lady, and one of the sub-adults broke back in.
User avatar
Kmuda
Mad Scientist
Mad Scientist
 
Posts: 16556
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2006 8:13 pm
Location: Fort Smith, Arkansas

Re: Title Changed to Kicking Nitrate's @ss?"

Postby Kmuda » Sat Dec 03, 2011 9:47 pm

It's Baaackkkk.......

Not running zero nitrates, but certainly closer to 5 than to 10. Nitrates were hitting 20ppm (at least) before the break down and media cleansing. We'll see if it gets back to maintaining zero nitrates or not, but it's certainly improved matters, again.
100g- Red Oscar Fish, Male Convict, 3 SDs - 20 gallon sump
55g - 21 Year Old Kissing Gourami + friends
55g - Angelfish - 29g Livebearer Community
4 Cats, 2 Shelties, 1 wife, 1 old lady, and one of the sub-adults broke back in.
User avatar
Kmuda
Mad Scientist
Mad Scientist
 
Posts: 16556
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2006 8:13 pm
Location: Fort Smith, Arkansas

Re: Title Changed to Kicking Nitrate's @ss?"

Postby Capt Dave » Fri Mar 16, 2012 9:54 am

Hey K!! I am Considering constructing one of these towers. Do you think that it would be possible to run one of these towers with a T in the outflow of a c-360 marineland? If so would the micron filters still need to be in place?(I am assuming yes but always value your opinions)
User avatar
Capt Dave
Symphysodon discus
 
Posts: 299
Joined: Sat Feb 20, 2010 5:34 pm
Location: Long Island, New York

Re: Title Changed to Kicking Nitrate's @ss?"

Postby Kmuda » Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:10 pm

It would not be possible to run on of those towers with any canister filter. I would not even try. You cannot underestimate how much uummppphhh it takes to push water through King Kong's Bong. :lol:

Not only would a canister filter not be powerful enough, the back-pressure would likely cause a leak around the motor seal.

Stick with a nice sized water pump, such as the Quiet One 4,000.
100g- Red Oscar Fish, Male Convict, 3 SDs - 20 gallon sump
55g - 21 Year Old Kissing Gourami + friends
55g - Angelfish - 29g Livebearer Community
4 Cats, 2 Shelties, 1 wife, 1 old lady, and one of the sub-adults broke back in.
User avatar
Kmuda
Mad Scientist
Mad Scientist
 
Posts: 16556
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2006 8:13 pm
Location: Fort Smith, Arkansas

Re: Title Changed to Kicking Nitrate's @ss?"

Postby Capt Dave » Fri Mar 16, 2012 10:25 pm

Ok I kinda figured that. I may have missed it but did you ever put the second whole house filter on the tower system?
User avatar
Capt Dave
Symphysodon discus
 
Posts: 299
Joined: Sat Feb 20, 2010 5:34 pm
Location: Long Island, New York

Re: Title Changed to Kicking Nitrate's @ss?"

Postby Kmuda » Sat Mar 17, 2012 10:41 am

Nope, not yet. I'm getting at least a month out of the filters I'm using so it has never become necessary. Keep in mind how much filtration I have on this system (combined with the low flow rate through the tower) so it's no surprise the micron filter does not get clogged quickly. Folks with less filtration may have different results and need to replace the micron cartridge more frequently.
100g- Red Oscar Fish, Male Convict, 3 SDs - 20 gallon sump
55g - 21 Year Old Kissing Gourami + friends
55g - Angelfish - 29g Livebearer Community
4 Cats, 2 Shelties, 1 wife, 1 old lady, and one of the sub-adults broke back in.
User avatar
Kmuda
Mad Scientist
Mad Scientist
 
Posts: 16556
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2006 8:13 pm
Location: Fort Smith, Arkansas

Re: Title Changed to Kicking Nitrate's @ss?"

Postby Desdinova » Mon Jun 04, 2012 5:36 pm

So, how important is the height of this device and the fact that it's standing up vertically? I'm wondering about using 4" flex pipe and coiling it under the tank, but you have implemented this so many times that I figured I would ask before I wasted time and money on that implementation. I got a bucket of Pond Matrix, but now I need to decide how I'm going to contain it.
Desdinova
Microgeophagus ramirezi
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Jun 04, 2012 5:30 pm

Re: Title Changed to Kicking Nitrate's @ss?"

Postby Kmuda » Tue Jun 05, 2012 1:25 pm

The denitrate tower does not contain Matrix. It contains SeaChem Denitrate, which is basically crumbled Matrix. I don't think you would achieve much level of denitrification using Pond Matrix. I consider the granular size of SeaChem Denitrate to be a critical component of success.

I've tried the "coil" concept. I've tried shorter tubes running in series, and I've tried horizontal tubes. I only achieved success with the tall tower AND the Micron filter, changing the cartridge in the filter every two weeks.

I don't want to discourage anyone from trying a different design. We all know the tall tower (King Kong's Bong) is an ugly contraption and it would be ideal to have something that could be hidden. I really don't know why my other designs did not result in the same success levels as the tall tower, although I did not have the Micron filter involved in those other designs.
100g- Red Oscar Fish, Male Convict, 3 SDs - 20 gallon sump
55g - 21 Year Old Kissing Gourami + friends
55g - Angelfish - 29g Livebearer Community
4 Cats, 2 Shelties, 1 wife, 1 old lady, and one of the sub-adults broke back in.
User avatar
Kmuda
Mad Scientist
Mad Scientist
 
Posts: 16556
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2006 8:13 pm
Location: Fort Smith, Arkansas

Previous

Return to Equipment and Accessories

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests